dr_weazel Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 http://www.democracyinaction.org/dia/organizationsORG/ncadp/content.jsp?content_KEY=2489&t=Innocent%20And%20Executed%20Section.dwt http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?&did=2238 http://www.abanet.org/irr/hr/fall97/deathpen.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_weazel Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 With respect to the innocent being sentenced to die and actually being executed; this senario is very rare One of the articles I posted above make a very good point that lawyers etc dont bother trying to clear an already executed prisoners name, as there's no point since they're dead already, it's easier to sweep it under the carpet and move on to trying to clear the name of someone still alive, so how can we possibly know just how rare it is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hakomi Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 Ok Weazel sorry if i wasnt clear enough in what i said i didnt mean to come across as advocating the death penalty. I actually agree for the most part with the points that you and catalyst have made. I was mearly trying to point out that this topic is all to easy to discuss logically until you have actually been affected by it. And if you think that buy me taking into account the feelings of the people actually affected buy these murders that im missing the point then Here is my only stand point i think multiple offenders should be locked up permanently. I dont know where you draw the line on locking them up for good though. That is all .......waits for weazel to find something to argue about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeb Posted August 5, 2008 Author Share Posted August 5, 2008 bread and water for life... breaking rocks in the hot sun.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.Gunn Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 human beings have been doing fucked up things to eachother for so long. it's so sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Known One Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 Some people deserve to die a horrible horrible death Dr Weasel... I'm all with you when it comes to not actually doing it on the grounds of it being impossible to implement without killing innocent people... but as far as the thou shall not kill line goes you be shouting, fuck that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_weazel Posted August 5, 2008 Share Posted August 5, 2008 Ok Weazel sorry if i wasnt clear enough in what i said i didnt mean to come across as advocating the death penalty. I actually agree for the most part with the points that you and catalyst have made. I was mearly trying to point out that this topic is all to easy to discuss logically until you have actually been affected by it. And if you think that buy me taking into account the feelings of the people actually affected buy these murders that im missing the point then Here is my only stand point i think multiple offenders should be locked up permanently. I dont know where you draw the line on locking them up for good though. That is all .......waits for weazel to find something to argue about The point I was making is that we can't let emotional feelings and desire for revenge overtake us, as it's just a step towards us all becoming just as bad as the criminals. So yea, you did miss it. Take note that I wasn't attacking your opinion directly, but attacking that particular point of view, because it's the same one that's brought up time and time again by people who want to use emotive, unbalanced arguments FOR the death penalty. If you hadn't said it, someone else would have... Sorry if it came across as a personal attack, perhaps I needed to make that clearer. I realise that you weren't personally advocating the death penalty, I was just using your comment to make a point that I felt needed to be made (i.e. People shouldn't let emotions affect their morality/ethics just because they're directly affected by the crime, and as a society we should be actively discouraging that sort of thinking) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_weazel Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Some people deserve to die a horrible horrible death Dr Weasel... I'm all with you when it comes to not actually doing it on the grounds of it being impossible to implement without killing innocent people... but as far as the thou shall not kill line goes you be shouting, fuck that. Ok, but I'd say the same thing about your "eye for an eye" attitude... fuck that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanecapper Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 has anyone here heard of the saying "genetics loads the gun but environment pulls the trigger"? most offenders out there are a product of their environment where most have grown up living a life of shit where they have been exposed to mental and physical abuse alot of us would never understand. how can you kill someone who hasnt even had a chance.... its such an "easy" solution. People make mistakes and although some of these mistakes that are made are completely unforgiveable, i think we should focus more on preventing this shit instead of thinking of ways to punish those caught up in this vicious cycle werd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_weazel Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Anyway... on the original topic: It's a pity there's no photos on this website, it would be awesome to find an NZ equivalent of Brian Peppers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_weazel Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Speaking of Brian Peppers ( if you havent heard of him, go here: http://www.snopes.com/photos/people/peppers.asp ) check this out, it's funny as hell! http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Brian_Peppers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nato Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Speaking of Brian Peppers ( if you havent heard of him, go here: http://www.snopes.com/photos/people/peppers.asp ) check this out, it's funny as hell! http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Brian_Peppers OMG!! Thats one ugly bitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dold Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 has anyone here heard of the saying "genetics loads the gun but environment pulls the trigger"? most offenders out there are a product of their environment where most have grown up living a life of shit where they have been exposed to mental and physical abuse alot of us would never understand. how can you kill someone who hasnt even had a chance.... its such an "easy" solution. People make mistakes and although some of these mistakes that are made are completely unforgiveable, i think we should focus more on preventing this shit instead of thinking of ways to punish those caught up in this vicious cycle werd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanecapper Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 poor lad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hakomi Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 has anyone here heard of the saying "genetics loads the gun but environment pulls the trigger"? most offenders out there are a product of their environment where most have grown up living a life of shit where they have been exposed to mental and physical abuse alot of us would never understand. how can you kill someone who hasnt even had a chance.... its such an "easy" solution. People make mistakes and although some of these mistakes that are made are completely unforgiveable, i think we should focus more on preventing this shit instead of thinking of ways to punish those caught up in this vicious cycle werd I agree but i also think people that have gone past the point of "help" should be locked away permanently (not killed) so as not to do damage to other people and actually carry on the cycle you talk about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeb Posted August 6, 2008 Author Share Posted August 6, 2008 all opinions aside for sec...just remember loads of these scumbags are out there on the loose waiting to and currently committing these evil acts upon each other and the unsuspecting members of the public that get in the way(i.e you,me everybody)and they couldnt give a fuck how our judicial system punishes them for their crimes...so just have a good browse through the list and remember their faces....you never know when you might run into one of them. not all of them have a picture up but lots of them do... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hakomi Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 The point I was making is that we can't let emotional feelings and desire for revenge overtake us, as it's just a step towards us all becoming just as bad as the criminals. So yea, you did miss it. Hmm i didnt realise this whole thread was about your point of view. My original statement wasn't just talking to you. I thought we were talking about the death penalty and the reasons for and against it. Newsflash weazel we are emotional animals not robots and as much as we would all like to be in charge of our emotions all of the time were not. All im saying is its very easy to sit high and mighty with your opinion on all of this when you haven't been affected by it. Neither you or me knows how it feels to have a loved one murdered and neither of us could predict our thoughts or actions if this did happen. I was just asking people to try consider the reasons others might promote the death penalty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dr_weazel Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 The point I was making is that we can't let emotional feelings and desire for revenge overtake us, as it's just a step towards us all becoming just as bad as the criminals. So yea, you did miss it. Hmm i didnt realise this whole thread was about your point of view. I dont rember saying that it was. You made a pointed argument at something I said, Not about "the whole thread", so perhaps pull your head in. Newsflash weazel we are emotional animals not robots and as much as we would all like to be in charge of our emotions all of the time were not. I never said we were, or should be, emotionless about these sorts of things. I said we shouldn't let those emotions take charge of the situation and dictate our reactions, or we become no better than the criminals themselves. All im saying is its very easy to sit high and mighty with your opinion on all of this when you haven't been affected by it. Neither you or me knows how it feels to have a loved one murdered and neither of us could predict our thoughts or actions if this did happen. I didn't think I was being high and mighty, I was merely pointing out that "revenge" is wrong, no matter what emotions are behind it. I guess you're still taking my comments as a personal attack on you, which it never was, so chill out a bit. YES I GET IT, people who have been raped, or had loved ones murdered will get emotional about it, sarcasm it's amazing I never thought of that before /sarcasm BUT THAT STILL DOESN"T MAKE REVENGE KILLING RIGHT. I was just asking people to try consider the reasons others might promote the death penalty. And I was merely pointing out the inconsistencies with those reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Awesome Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hakomi Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 whoop de whoop i go crazy this shit aint worth it. KILL EM ALL hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 I actually really agree with Dr Weasel on this one, although your argument is sometimes obtusely worded it really is spot on... when i first visited the site and saw some of the shit that has gone down in my own country my immediate instinct was that they should all be locked up and had the key thrown away... but think about this, the only story you get to hear on there is of the terrible events of the crime (often through the herald reports which i think we can all agree are somewhat sensationalist at times) you hear nothing really of these people's trouble upbringings and pasts. Bottom line though imo: If you kill someone deliberately you should be locked up and never let out. The chance of parole should only exist for lesser crimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Grant Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh Grant Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 wow, what an entertaining/informative and productive discussion. Dr Weazel, you have very strong premises and your conclusion and sub conclusion is magnificent...But like the 'Samurai' whose history is dripped in revenge, I my self would love to some rapist/murderous biyartch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phonetics Posted August 6, 2008 Share Posted August 6, 2008 wow, what an entertaining/informative and productive discussion. Dr Weazel, you have very strong premises and your conclusion and sub conclusion is magnificent...But like the 'Samurai' whose history is dripped in revenge, I my self would love to some rapist/murderous biyartch! i second that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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